Rob's 24V Conversion

Discussion in 'Members Capris' started by robt100, 14 May 2012.

  1. robt100

    robt100 Registered Capri Power Member

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    Spark plugs are wet when i take them out. Would that also explain the backfire/kickback on the starter though? I assume it could be slow burning to the point where its only getting going when the piston is heading back up?
    As for piston/cylinder order, from what I've read (though it mainly pertains to ford v8 engines:confused:) is that the cylinders are numbered front to back, left side first. IE 1-2-3 front to back left bank, then 4-5-6 front to back right back. So opposite cylinders would be 1 and 4, 2 and 5, 3 and 6. is that right?
    That image you just uploaded I think its for a non-BOA coil pack, as it has the CBA timing rather than BCA?
     
  2. Ptgladstone

    Ptgladstone Registered Capri Power Member

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    Yes that’s right on the cylinders
     
  3. robt100

    robt100 Registered Capri Power Member

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    Right, think Job for my next free week is Intake off again (horror job!) and re-check the injectors are wired correctly, and also leads are correct. Thanks for the help so far!

    EDIT: or I could use my brain. It's batch fuelling so doesnt matter. Also, the car ran on the old ECU with the leads where they are (well, for a while, then that stopped running too, though that was more down to it being on the wrong fuel pump i think. LArge lph, no pressure!) So going to change the plugs and fuel and see how it goes.
     
    Last edited: 1 January 2019
  4. Ptgladstone

    Ptgladstone Registered Capri Power Member

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    Worth checking the injector wiring
     
  5. Ptgladstone

    Ptgladstone Registered Capri Power Member

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    I’ll open my motec and emerald maps tomorrow and have a look at the configuration
     
  6. robt100

    robt100 Registered Capri Power Member

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    Thanks peter.
    I did think of loading up an MSQ map someone sent for their BOB map. But as it uses sequential fuelling on extra drivers it'd be a no-go. But will try and match their fuelling numbers once I've got the new spark plugs.
     
  7. Ptgladstone

    Ptgladstone Registered Capri Power Member

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    Worth a try and modify the injector outputs. can alway reload your current map if it doesn’t work
     
  8. Ptgladstone

    Ptgladstone Registered Capri Power Member

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    The firing order on the 24v Cosworth is 1-4-2-5-3-6 (wasted spark) and if the injectors are grouped in pairs, you should have cyclinders 1 & 5, 4 & 3 then 2 & 6.
     
    Last edited: 3 January 2019
  9. robt100

    robt100 Registered Capri Power Member

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    As far as I know, standard ECU mapping is 2 injector drivers in batch form. Not sure which 3 are paired together though. Will double check with the builder!
     
  10. Ptgladstone

    Ptgladstone Registered Capri Power Member

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    Yeah a standard ECU is grouped in 3’s. This grouping is 1, 3, 5 and 2, 4, 6
     
    Last edited: 5 January 2019
  11. robt100

    robt100 Registered Capri Power Member

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    Well, time flies doesn't it!

    Since that last message, well, what has happened?
    Firstly, the ECU decided it was no longer going to produce spark or run the fuel pump :rolleyes: So that's been fun to try and sort. I almost sold the car due to some financial strife..
    I've had someone out to fit the land rover master cylinder so I now have brakes :D
    I've done a lot of the little jobs I needed to do. Filled her up with fresh fuel, and on Tuesday someone is coming over to fix the ECU issues, map the car and hopefully.....get an MOT!

    Still a couple of jobs to do though, the cir-clip has popped off the speedo cable on the g/box side so that needs re-attaching, the splash guards need fitting, it really needs a refresh on the suspension and brakes too but they are perfectly serviceable in the meantime. The dash fascia needs a little fixing, and I've got new alloys to go on, but I need new tyres and hub-centric spacers first. So, as is typical with a project there's plenty more to do.
     
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  12. caprinerd

    caprinerd Registered Capri Power Member

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    fingers crossed on your MOT but after all the work youve done cant see why i would fail
     
  13. robt100

    robt100 Registered Capri Power Member

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    The speedo cable popping off meaning I have no speed might do it :eek:.
    Whilst being a good little housewife and shopping in Aldi today I happened to browse through the specialbuys section (as all men should do) and found a pack of little angle-irons for £3. So far they have built me a battery securing bracket, and a fuel filter bracket along with plenty of holes to cable tie wires/pipes/cables into place! :D

    All thats left for tomorrow is to finish charging up the battery, change the oil, and pray it works;)
     
  14. Caprick1

    Caprick1 Registered Capri Power Member

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    If you need any help with the megasquirt let me know. I Built, programmed, built the loom and road tuned mine on my 2.8 efi turbo. :)
     
  15. robt100

    robt100 Registered Capri Power Member

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    well, that bit didnt go to plan.......

    The Mrs has my car, which has my trolley jack in :rolleyes: so had to get inventive with getting the car up....
    Then, the sump bolt is in solid, and the head has started to round off! So now im stuck with not being able to change the oil which needs doing before i can start it:mad: as per usual with this car, it all goes so well till the final part that should be "easy".
     
  16. robt100

    robt100 Registered Capri Power Member

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    Right, engine fires up! (we will ignore the fact the leads were on the wrong plugs:oops:)....but headlights arent working. turns out I have no chassis earth! so just sorting that before the trip to the MOT
     
  17. robt100

    robt100 Registered Capri Power Member

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    So, MOT.................Failure :(

    But, thankfully just on a few bulbs (They managed to miss the blowing exhaust, lack of speedo, rev counter and temp gauge!) so probably more earthing issues, that and a sidelight bulb that was stuck in the holder and not working, so Steve is finding a replacement unit...apparently they are in a bag hanging up somewhere :confused: so hopefully pick it up Friday and get to the lanc meet on Saturday. Which should be interesting without a temp gauge or speedo, though on the trip from Norwich to March it just sat between 86-94c whether moving or stationary so it should be ok.
     
  18. Ptgladstone

    Ptgladstone Registered Capri Power Member

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    Greats news Rob enjoy your first drive out
     
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  19. Kris

    Kris Moderator Staff Member Moderator

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    Get the app on your phone, it’s fairly accurate for the Speedo! Probably more accurate than the one on your dash lol!

    Well done for sticking with it and getting this far!
     
  20. Clockwork Orange

    Clockwork Orange Glasgow Subway- Keeping it simple since 1896 Staff Member Moderator

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    well done Robt ..
    and fair winds for you on Saturday to the Bomber Run ...
     
  21. caprinerd

    caprinerd Registered Capri Power Member

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    wish i was going but alas its not to be this year
     
  22. Crash & Burn

    Crash & Burn Registered Capri Power Member

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    I hope all has worked out for you to make the meet, which should be a huge satisfaction - For all the history you've made, you're one of the most deserving to be there.
     
  23. Clockwork Orange

    Clockwork Orange Glasgow Subway- Keeping it simple since 1896 Staff Member Moderator

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    just take a TomTom .. shows you decent directions, and gives you GPS speed readings .. don't need no phone app sh!t..
    Enjoy the day Robt - you have worked hard, now reap the reward ..
     
  24. robt100

    robt100 Registered Capri Power Member

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    Don't worry, the satnav is coming with me (none of this tomtom rubbish though, cant stand them!).

    MOT is passed and car is taxed. Picking it up from Steve tomorrow morning....its 90mins there, then another 90mins to the Lanc meet. Hopefully arriving between 10:30 and 11am! :D
    Been wanting to go to this one since the first one all those years ago, so it'll be nice to finally get there (not that I'll know any faces, I haven't been 'on the scene' for about 8 years!), so feel free to come and say hi.
     
  25. robt100

    robt100 Registered Capri Power Member

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    Well, the Lanc meet went well! Got there and back nice and safely (if a little noisily) and had a great time.......BUT.....

    She's leaking oil out of the engine like a pig, I am currently trying to work out if its the rocker or the oil return pipe, I got a few snaps which should hopefully help. They are new gaskets as Trev rebuilt the engine so I'm not too sure why it'd leak so bad, though the rear rocker cover bolt is very tight!

    Drivers side: nice and clean..
    IMG-20190904-WA0009.jpg

    Passenger side: Not looking so good.
    IMG-20190904-WA0008.jpg

    This was under the exhaust sheild:

    IMG-20190904-WA0007.jpg

    IMG-20190904-WA0006.jpg

    Looks like its been having a good leak all over, but the oil seems to only be hitting in one spot by the oil return pipe:

    IMG-20190904-WA0001.jpg

    Could it just be the return pipe thats the issue? I nipped it up the other day just incase, but then on a.....spirited drive for 5 mins yesterday, as I parked up in the garage there was the largest ploom of oil smoke I've had so far!

    So, has anyone got any ideas? Looks like I still wont make it to brooklands:(. But I would at least like to get this fixed before it sits over winter.

    Heres a shot from underneath of that pipe
    IMG-20190904-WA0003.jpg
    IMG-20190904-WA0002.jpg
     
  26. mgentry90

    mgentry90 Registered Capri Power Member

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    Is that a hose or a pop and is it resting/rubbing on the exhaust manifold nut/stud? Maybe worn a hole?
     
  27. Ptgladstone

    Ptgladstone Registered Capri Power Member

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    The good old leaky 24v Cosworth engine! Got be either the gasket, return or both hard to tell from the photo. The oil return pipes are a pain I modified mine in the end.

    I would run the engine then sit and watch for the oil
     
  28. robt100

    robt100 Registered Capri Power Member

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    Possibly, although the leak seems to be falling onto the top of the manifold, which would suggest its right at the top where the return meets the head.

    Aye, running and watching is next, well, someone keep it running (warm up enrichments arent tuned yet) and check for leaks.
    What was the problem with your return pipes and how did you modify them in the end? Might be handy to know!;)
     
  29. Ptgladstone

    Ptgladstone Registered Capri Power Member

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    I had the same problem, leaking onto the manifold.

    If it’s leaking from the return, check the O ring going into the head could be missing or bust and reassemble with some RTV silicon.

    I modified the spacers that the bolt sits in. I bet you can move the return backwards and forwards? All I did was file a-few mill of the spacer so it grabbed the oil return tightly and couldn’t move, hasn’t leaked since
     
  30. robt100

    robt100 Registered Capri Power Member

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    I shall check if I get a chance on friday. Can't remember it feeling loose, but nipping up the bolt a quarter of a turn seems to have made it worse than last time?:confused:
     
  31. BigJ

    BigJ Registered Capri Power Member

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    I’d be checking the cam cover gaskets as well as the oil returns. Last thing you want is an oil fire in the engine bay. It’s just cost me a fortune to get my oil leaks sorted out and that was after months of me trying to do it myself.

    One thing that did help the cam cover gaskets seal was to grind 1mm off the steel inserts that the cam cover bolts pass through. This allows additional compression of the gasket to get a better seal. I found the flat seals to be better than the profiled and thinner ones.
     
  32. robt100

    robt100 Registered Capri Power Member

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    Right, had a little go at sourcing leaks..... could only run it for about 30seconds before the burning oil meant I couldn't see a thing! Nothing obvious from the return pipe, but running my finger along the edge of the rocker cover I got some nice fresh oil on my fingertip:rolleyes:

    It also looks like the tensioner gasket is leaky (must be high quality to have lasted all of 200miles....) so got to get that fixed too. Though not sure on the process for that one as I'd assume I need to un-tension the chain first?

    Sadly I've got wheel bearings and CV Joints on the way out on the work car, and insurance to pay in december, then a replacment PC to build in the new year.....so the car is off the road until spring I think:(
     
  33. BigJ

    BigJ Registered Capri Power Member

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    Timing chain tensioner needs to be locked and removed to replace the gasket. To access it you need to remove the alternator, cam belt tensioner, cam belt, power steering pump if fitted and the large bracket that supports them. There’s a procedure to follow to remove the tensioner correctly in a 4 part YT vid of Ford technicians stripping a BOA down and reassembling it.

    If the tensioner gasket is leaking then you should find fresh oil on top of the alternator but don’t assume this is the cause. I replaced mine and the cam cover gaskets at great expense but still had an annoying drip from high up. I found out it was where the timing case gasket meets the underside of the cylinder head but as the timing case gasket in this area is actually an extension of the head gasket, the heads needed to come off to have the head gaskets replaced. Engine is as dry as a bone now but to get it properly fixed including a light skim of the heads for flatness cost over £1600.

    Think about this before you dive in.
     
  34. robt100

    robt100 Registered Capri Power Member

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    Right, I've given everything a proper clean up (including that return pipe that goes under the manifold, well as best as i can with brake cleaner in a pressurized can!) so hoping to have another check just incase the smoke when I ran it last was the old leak burning off as I know Trev said the rockers leaked badly when he first fit them but had 'fixed' it. Then, as funds don't allow anything else, it'll have to be parked up till spring:(
     
  35. robt100

    robt100 Registered Capri Power Member

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    Some sad news....The Capri has to go!:(:(

    All the problems mentioned above are currently being fixed, so she will be 100% for the next owner.
    Sadly, I've been told I'm loosing my job (a nice Christmas present from my company), and have been offered the opportunity to start my own business further afield, so the Capri has to go to open up some funds. I don't want her to go, but this opportunity is better for not only myself, but my family and their mental health, so its a no-brainer. For now it will only be put up on here, as I want it to go to someone who will appreciate it, rather than just sell it on or abuse it, but I may have to advertise elsewhere in the coming weeks.
     
  36. Ptgladstone

    Ptgladstone Registered Capri Power Member

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    That’s soon unpleasant news to receive at Christmas Rob. Hope you get sorted
     
  37. Crash & Burn

    Crash & Burn Registered Capri Power Member

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    It is a hard lump of news, but if its value truly does all that for your family, then worth doing. Hopefully a new business will afford you a replacement one day, while you're still visiting here. Your concern for the car's condition as it moves away is very nice to see. I hope for good luck with your sale.
     
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  38. robt100

    robt100 Registered Capri Power Member

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    Thanks for the kind words guys.. Still plodding on with getting the finishing touches done. Last day of work today so now have plenty of time to get her sorted!

    Got the exhaust parts yesterday, so did a quick mock-up to see how they will lay out, seems a shame to put them under the car:D

    IMG-20200131-WA0003.jpeg
     
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  39. robt100

    robt100 Registered Capri Power Member

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    Got the old exhaust off and measured up the new one....its a perfect fit! Not bad for no measuring taking place:D
    I also found out why the speedo wasn't working, the end of the cable had snapped off. So I ordered a few bits from Tickover, and now I'm in possesion of a new speedo cable, new exhaust rubbers, and a replacement Ariel. Next week should be finishing-up week, then its all tip-top and sadly going up for sale:rolleyes::(
     
  40. Clockwork Orange

    Clockwork Orange Glasgow Subway- Keeping it simple since 1896 Staff Member Moderator

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    such a shame you have to let it go after all the time and effort ...
    really does look good
     
  41. robt100

    robt100 Registered Capri Power Member

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    Right, long overdue update. Managed to fool myself into keeping the car a bit longer, got it moved with us 'up north' but turns out the Council Garage isn't water-tight, and I can't bare to see it end up rotting away due to a damp garage, especially after it had all the bodywork restored and the conversion done at Steadspeed, so she needs to sell. But I need to fix a couple of bits first.

    My main issue is the fact it sometimes wont turn off. The car runs a Megasquirt ECU with its own standalone loom, takes switched live from the ignition barrel and earths to the block. But sometimes you can turn off the key (usually more shorter journeys than long) and the car just keeps running, even once they key is removed. BUT it can be stopped by selecting reverse, not releasing the clutch just triggering the reverse lights. I haven't tried to see if it does the same turning on any other lights yet (very short on time with the new business) but im thinking its pointing to some kind of feedback loop off the alternator, but I really don't know what im doing when it comes to the alternator and charging circuits.

    I also have a fun idle issue, but I think thats mainly down to a miscalculated injector deadtime and the open-loop idle its currently on, so I know where im going with that.
     
  42. Clockwork Orange

    Clockwork Orange Glasgow Subway- Keeping it simple since 1896 Staff Member Moderator

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    dim dip headlamps??
    wrong relay?
    do you have the sides on at all when you go to shut the engine down.. If so, next time.. leave the lights on, switch off the engine.. then switch off the lights!
    if it works, pull the relay and bin it.. the real relay is a specialised item, not a standard relay..
     
  43. robt100

    robt100 Registered Capri Power Member

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    Although its an '86 laser originally, I don't think it has dim dip, no relay dooberry under the rad cowl, all lights seem to work individually from what I remember. Never tried it with the lights on, so it might be a direction to go in.
    Fuel pump, Ignition and ECU relays all run from a seperate fuse box powered by the 12v switched feed. So something is holding that switched feed from the ignition open to keep the relays powered. Will try with other light combos next time it does it to see if it is triggered by any lights or just reverse. Might get there tomorrow evening but we shall see.
     
  44. therealpinto

    therealpinto Registered Capri Power Member

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    I have had similar issues and I now have diode fitted to the alternator D+. But I also changed where that connects to the loom so I am not 100% certain it was the fix. Plus, I run a Suzuki Swift alternator...

    A simple way to make sure it is the alternator keeping the engine alive, is to try it without the alternator drive belt.

    Then you can try a 1 amp 200V diode between D+ and the loom. It should allow current from the loom to the alternator but not the other way around (arrow on diode pointing towards alternator).

    Gustaf
     
  45. robt100

    robt100 Registered Capri Power Member

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    I've seen a few suggestions of a diode fitted to the alternator. As the ECU loom connects at the igniton barrel and the engine earth as its only two points, where would this go?:confused:
     
  46. therealpinto

    therealpinto Registered Capri Power Member

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    Usually it goes to the small + feed to the alternator, or the alternator light. In my case, with the Suzuki alternator, it has a separate positive feed to "start" the alternator and that is where I have the diode.

    Gustaf
     

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